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Ipe Piccardt Brouwer
Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 64 Location: Netherlands, Winkel NH
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tpaliwoda
Joined: 03 Nov 2006 Posts: 215 Location: USA, Raritan YC, Perth Amboy, New Jersey
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| Posted: Fri 09 Oct 09, 22:28 |
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Article is in Dutch I believe.
The translation wasn't that great on Google.
If I was to bet on what went wrong, I would guess the water stay broke.
The article did say that the two people on the boat were ok.
Ted _________________ Ted Paliwoda
D'Fly 1000 ; HN #1
Nice Tri
Raritan YC, Perth Amboy, NJ, USA |
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Oscar
Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 148 Location: USA, North East
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| Posted: Thu 15 Oct 09, 23:22 |
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I do speak Dutch.
Force 6, not too much. Article states one float broke off/loose and boat capsized. Rescue teams were out already looking for missing racer which they had just located, no emergency there, so they quickly went to the tri. They tried to right it, but in that process it dismasted. (we know why). It was towed in all but submerged after which it was pumped out.
No further details. _________________ 1990 Dragonfly 25 USA-54 |
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Ipe Piccardt Brouwer
Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 64 Location: Netherlands, Winkel NH
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| Posted: Mon 19 Oct 09, 9:54 |
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Rumour has it that there was a structural failure other than broken waterstay or forgotten safety strut. Possibly a broken beam or hinge.
Last wednesday a friend saw it passing by on a truck heading north on the A7 so i'm guessing its headed for Denmark for investigation. _________________ Ipe Piccardt Brouwer
DF920-28 'Ngalawa', Medemblik |
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Oscar
Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 148 Location: USA, North East
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| Posted: Tue 27 Oct 09, 22:44 |
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Hey Ipe, jij in Medemblik? Vriendje van mij is havenmeester daar.... _________________ 1990 Dragonfly 25 USA-54 |
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Ipe Piccardt Brouwer
Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 64 Location: Netherlands, Winkel NH
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| Posted: Wed 28 Oct 09, 7:52 |
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Welke haven? Ik lig in het regattacenter. _________________ Ipe Piccardt Brouwer
DF920-28 'Ngalawa', Medemblik |
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Oscar
Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 148 Location: USA, North East
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| Posted: Thu 29 Oct 09, 1:33 |
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Hij was havenmeester in de Pekelharing haven, maar de gemeente heeft die aangelsoten bij de andere gemeente havens, dus hij zit nu in het torentje tussen de Westerhaven en de Oosterhaven. _________________ 1990 Dragonfly 25 USA-54 |
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Bo Wetzel Site Admin
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 Posts: 156 Location: UK, Penzance & France, Flayosc
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| "Dutch" Forum Posted: Thu 29 Oct 09, 9:53 |
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Dear Ipe and Oscar.
I'm lucky enough do understand what your discussion is about but I still think if would be better to stick to English so all members understand the messages.
Thank you for your understanding in this matter. |
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Oscar
Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 148 Location: USA, North East
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| Posted: Thu 29 Oct 09, 23:22 |
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Roger that. _________________ 1990 Dragonfly 25 USA-54 |
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Ipe Piccardt Brouwer
Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 64 Location: Netherlands, Winkel NH
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| More info Posted: Sun 01 Nov 09, 23:08 |
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There's a report of the incident by the owner of the unfortunate ship in our dutch multihull club magazine 'CTC nieuws'.
He was sailing at a speed of 11 knots in wind about 20 knots, 1 reef, slight to modest wave action. Suddenly a spontaneous breakage occured in the front starboard beam, shortly followed by the rear beam and capsize follows. Total timespan about 5 seconds.
Investigation afterwards reveals that both waterstays are still intact and mounted properly. So primary failure seems to be fracture of the beam. Very remarkable fact: this was a new beam, mounted at the start of this season! Story doesn't tell why a new beam was necessary. _________________ Ipe Piccardt Brouwer
DF920-28 'Ngalawa', Medemblik |
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Ipe Piccardt Brouwer
Joined: 01 Nov 2006 Posts: 64 Location: Netherlands, Winkel NH
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| Meanwhile... Posted: Mon 02 Nov 09, 14:24 |
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...other sources tell me they doubt this story. They think that the primary failure was the swing wing line. Folding occured, then fracture and total collapse. Let's hope that investigation will clear this up! _________________ Ipe Piccardt Brouwer
DF920-28 'Ngalawa', Medemblik |
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Anders B
Joined: 18 Nov 2006 Posts: 23 Location: Denmark, Aarhus
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| Posted: Mon 02 Nov 09, 19:24 |
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Hi !
The story is very similar to the df35 that broke last year here in Denmark - in this case it was the front line which should prevent folding that wasn't in the right place !
/anders. _________________ Anders Brandt
DF 25 Smultronbris |
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Slowhand
Joined: 26 Apr 2007 Posts: 13 Location: Denmark/Aarhus
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| Posted: Wed 04 Nov 09, 0:02 |
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There is no such frontline on a 'common' 920 - you will only find it on the Extreme.
I wrote Jens Q mid October but he were not able to tell anything until the cause is fully determined and cleared with the owner.
We hopefully can look forward to an explanation from Jen Q soon
//Henrik |
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Mika Harju
Joined: 02 Nov 2006 Posts: 217 Location: Finland, Turku
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| Re: Meanwhile... Posted: Wed 04 Nov 09, 18:44 |
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| Ipe Piccardt Brouwer wrote: | | ...other sources tell me they doubt this story. They think that the primary failure was the swing wing line. Folding occured, then fracture and total collapse. Let's hope that investigation will clear this up! |
If this is the case I have got one solution to prevent this:
http://www.dragonfly-trimarans.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=1161#1161 _________________ Mika Harju
DF1000 Racing #8 |
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Slowhand
Joined: 26 Apr 2007 Posts: 13 Location: Denmark/Aarhus
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| Posted: Wed 04 Nov 09, 21:03 |
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Hi Mika - the drawings were not attached - please send them to me on henrik@voldsgaard.com
Thanks
//Henrik |
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Mal
Joined: 02 Nov 2006 Posts: 83 Location: Wales
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| 920 Broken Float Posted: Wed 04 Nov 09, 23:11 |
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Why would failure of the swing wing line cause the float to fold back? Surely the point of the pin in the tube brace between the main hull stern and the aft beam should stop the folding?? _________________ DF920 Pelican, Swansea |
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Slowhand
Joined: 26 Apr 2007 Posts: 13 Location: Denmark/Aarhus
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| Posted: Thu 05 Nov 09, 0:05 |
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Hopefully you are right, but the truth is, that we can produce hypotheses from now on to christmas evening.
I think it's time for Quorning to comment on this issue!
Another way to go is contacting the 920-owner directly. Is there anyone who has contact details? What about our Dutch friends? Maybe it is possible to get a copy of the survey report.
I'm curious
//Henrik |
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Bo Wetzel Site Admin
Joined: 01 Jan 1970 Posts: 156 Location: UK, Penzance & France, Flayosc
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| DF Anti-Folding System Posted: Thu 05 Nov 09, 9:57 |
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I've now attached the drawing to Mika's message (see above).
An interesting and simple idea! |
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Mika Harju
Joined: 02 Nov 2006 Posts: 217 Location: Finland, Turku
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| Re: 920 Broken Float Posted: Thu 05 Nov 09, 13:47 |
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| Mal wrote: | | Why would failure of the swing wing line cause the float to fold back? Surely the point of the pin in the tube brace between the main hull stern and the aft beam should stop the folding?? |
This is bigger problem with DF1000, because the tube length/diameter/thickness ratio is worse.
If DF1000 is flying two hulls and the SwingWing line breaks down I would like to be somewhere else without a backup system .
From engineering point of view the original tube might not be robust enough.
DF920 has shorter tubes so the problem might be smaller, but anyhow DF920X has similar system as backup. _________________ Mika Harju
DF1000 Racing #8 |
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Mal
Joined: 02 Nov 2006 Posts: 83 Location: Wales
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| Mika's Drawing to prevent folding. Posted: Thu 05 Nov 09, 14:18 |
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Looks OK, but isn't a line from the end of the front crossbeam to the mooring cleat each side of the bow easier? There's too much friction via lines in the folding system anyway, wouldn't want to add any more dragging lines and blocks.
I sail across Swansea Bay on my way back to port, passing all the monohulls. I enter the river ready to lock in, and whilst I am winching in the floats and folding, all the monohulls catch up, pass me, and go in the lock before me! Ce la vie! _________________ DF920 Pelican, Swansea |
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Mika Harju
Joined: 02 Nov 2006 Posts: 217 Location: Finland, Turku
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| Re: Mika's Drawing to prevent folding. Posted: Thu 05 Nov 09, 14:27 |
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| Mal wrote: | Looks OK, but isn't a line from the end of the front crossbeam to the mooring cleat each side of the bow easier? There's too much friction via lines in the folding system anyway, wouldn't want to add any more dragging lines and blocks.
I sail across Swansea Bay on my way back to port, passing all the monohulls. I enter the river ready to lock in, and whilst I am winching in the floats and folding, all the monohulls catch up, pass me, and go in the lock before me! Ce la vie! |
My backup system is completely independent. It is not using the original SwinWing lines or blocks anyhow. The direction of the rope (and force) is better in my system to hold the floats open if something goes wrong. _________________ Mika Harju
DF1000 Racing #8 |
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jf.brodin
Joined: 22 Dec 2006 Posts: 6 Location: France/Quiberon
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| Posted: Fri 06 Nov 09, 13:07 |
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| Ipe Piccardt Brouwer wrote: | Rumour has it that there was a structural failure other than broken waterstay or forgotten safety strut. Possibly a broken beam or hinge.
Last wednesday a friend saw it passing by on a truck heading north on the A7 so i'm guessing its headed for Denmark for investigation. |
Hope we shall have a complete report of what happened from Qorning! |
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